OPINION: GRAPPLING WITH GAUTENG’S PRIDE PROBLEM
Simon Nkoli at the first Johannesburg Pride march
(Pic courtesy of Gala)
It’s Johannesburg (read Sandton) Pride again on the 25th of October and it has reminded Dylan van Vuuren and Gabriel Hoosain Khan of a discussion they don’t believe our community has completely dealt with. And we do need closure on our Pride problems, they say. Van Vuuren and Khan ask you to join them in an attempt at being conscious gay community members.
Currently there are five Pride events in Gauteng (Ekurhuleni Pride in KwaThema, Soweto Pride, People’s Pride at Constitution Hill, Johannesburg Pride in Sandton and Pretoria Pride in Centurion). The number of Prides do not reflect a growth in LGBTI activism, these represent a community more divided than ever.
Let’s flash back 25 years ago to the first Johannesburg Pride. It all started in 1990 as a march organised by a group of activists called the Gays and Lesbians of the Witwatersrand (GLOW). This makes it the longest running and the largest Pride on the continent. It was founded by Simon Nkoli, also an anti-apartheid activist and member of the Congress of South African Student and the United Democratic Front.
Simon expressed in his speech at this first march how he experienced racism in the gay rights movement and homophobia in the anti-apartheid movement. The theme of the first Pride was ‘unity in the community’ and the political vision was that of a march that would highlight intersecting forms of discrimination and bring a fractured community together. We have failed at this objective; the issue is now as relevant as ever. (Simon is probably turning in his grave at the state of the Pride movement.)
But we have done it before: the first Pride march successfully united the diverse parts of the lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender community for a moment during the euphoria of the 1990s transition, but the situation was and still is complicated. Our progressive Constitution, which promised to protect people from discrimination based on sexual orientation and gender, has been met with a reality of a country where LGBTI people experience violent transphobia and homophobia.
(Pic courtesy of Gala)
The hope of non-racialism has been met by the reality that most South Africans are black, poor, do not have access to cars or computers and certainly do not have access to the rights promised to LGBTI in our Constitution and law.
It is because of this dichotomy that the One in Nine campaign, a feminist collective, protested Johannesburg Pride in 2012 – bringing these issues of segregation and access to the forefront and upsetting the pretty Pride parade.
They aimed to question the relevance of the event, which had become increasingly commercial, largely apolitical and discriminating against people based on race and class. This was reflected by the fact that the board of Johannesburg Pride and its audience was largely white and middle-class.
The event was hosted in a place which was difficult to access, privileged (Rosebank being an affluent neighbourhood) and far away from where most of the community live (in townships, in the city centre and other suburbs). Lastly, it became an event which was too expensive for most people to access – people were not allowed to being their own food and drink – and food and drink sold inside was too expensive for people to afford.
The One in Nine protest and critique of Pride led to the organisation folding. This moment of anarchy also led to a promising series of community meetings. At these meetings, it was decided that the community would need to create an ethos for Pride and from this a structure for the event would emerge. But tensions between activists interested in the politics of Pride and community members interested in being pragmatic about the event led to a breakdown. A group of community members broke away from the group and elected themselves as the Johannesburg Pride committee. The community members who continued with the series of community meetings culminated in the People’s Pride events in Johannesburg.
This is where our conversation becomes a hard one. Where to from here? Do we stay segregated in each of our little Prides or do we boycott all of them until unity is the only option?
We don’t know the answers but what we do know is that if a Pride event reproduces an assemblage of inequality going against all that Pride was founded on – as we believe Johannesburg Pride has done in recent years – it is not something we can support.
One in Nine protest at Joburg Pride in 2012 (Pic courtesy of Gala)
We cannot support an event which created a fenced boundary for rich, mostly white people to celebrate Pride, while outside that fence sit people of colour who do not have access to that privileged space. This is essentially how the apartheid system worked – a system of enforcing boundaries and access to rights and resources based on categories – of race and class, gender and sexuality.
The only way we see a way forward is for people to be informed – especially the new young gay generation that is mostly unaware of the fight that came before them. Gay people need to know why we have Pride and the history behind it in order to make informed decisions and avoid repeating history.
In the meantime we’ll keep wishing we could all get along like we used to in 1990. We wish we could bake a cake made out of rainbows and smiles and that we would all eat it and be happy. If only it were that simple.
Read Johannesburg Pride’s response here.
Do you agree with Van Vuuren and Khan’s take on the state of Pride in Johannesburg and Gauteng? Tell us your thoughts below. (Please note, offensive, insulting and personal comments will be removed.)
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Absolutely true 100 percent right what Gabriel and van vuuren are saying – the struggle is devided! Pride has turned in to an annual get together picnic and yet that agenda is pushed by previlaged .
This article is extremely true! It’s sad as a minority to find ourselves further seperated by race. One would think we’d stick together and when one of us falls, we’d all come together and speak out. It’s easy to see the seperation, just look at all the funerals of fallen lgbti members, most of the people there are black. Sad how we don’t know how to put our differences aside and work for the common good. We don’t have to cut out the celebration part from Pride, but it sure does need to remain political in nature.
This is exactly why we get up off our middle class white asses, get out of our comfort zone and go to Soweto Pride. I’d rather march for something than party for nothing.
True Beth, and I’m also going to Sandton Pride as well, no fence should ever divide us, I mean, everyone deserve some #HomoLove if there’s division… I’m breaking the walls/going over the fence, whatever the case may be. It’s MY Pride.
The Johannesburg pride is open to all. Us Homos are everything but homogenous, and any attempt to try and please all will simply result in displeasing all. Let’s unite in our diversity and attend the Prides where we feel comfortable. If you want to sit in a lecture on Pride day, or roll in the streets, please do so; but it is not my cup of tea.
I moved to South Africa 2 weeks ago, and I was so happy to learn I just made it on time for Pride in Joburg, cool! Now finding out that in one metropolis there are 5 different Prides year around, in 5 different districts, depending on color of skin and wealth is alarming. I bet LGBT is still a small community even in South Africa, and hence one would expect that the more focused and centralized the efforts the bigger the visibility, awareness, participation, and ultimately impact it can create. Can you help me where and when is the Pride full of happy people, marching & dancing through the city with the sound of music, where everyone can bring their full self to Pride? Black or white, young or old, rich or poor? Isn’t it better to have one Pride with half a million of people once a year, than 5 prides with 5 thousand people each? Just saying 😉
https://www.mambaonline.com/2014/10/16/grappling-gautengs-pride-problems/
And this is how some writers think, stereotyping, marginalizing and entire race group or culture, spreading hatred, giving false truths in some instances and then hoping the other “not so bad” or “angels arguments” will make it all look good. I can agree on a lot of things, (such as some of the Prides have become very commercialised, and not catering for all factions of the gay community), but to attack a specific race group (perhaps this EFF thing is getting to him?), insulting probably other pride events is really not going to bring any unity to our gay community or create any form of constructive change, it just incites more hate. Who wants to join a group of people who have already setup up a pre-line of insult and hatred towards you? Would you, no you won’t.
Mr Gabriel Hoosain Khan have been known for always going for controversial racial slurs and dis-reputing an entire race group for some of the strangest reasons, in the past, I have encountered him before. Perhaps he is driving some “dominance” pleasure from this I’m not sure…
I am sorry Mr Khan, but you are not at all trying or attempting to create unity, as you are insulting the wrong people.
But by one example (there are many) The old Joburg Pride was located in Zoo Lake (in its later years) as the chancellor of the area were willing to sign off the rights to host the event in the streets, provided the necessary security, and the correct setting to host such an expensive event ranging into the hundreds of thousands of Rands, with free entrance). If you use google maps you will notice the following about the Randburg location: Pretoria CBD to Zoo Lake (Pretoria, a location to where many whites come, are about 55 km in distance from Zoo Lake). Tembisa (a general black area) is situated 36 km away. Soweto is situated 31 km away, Joburg CBD is situated 8 km away, and Hillbrow even less so. Even the East of Joburg has better access to Zoo Lake. The majority of people who had to travel to the old Joburg Pride, had to travel great distances, some even coming from other provinces. You think hosting it in Soweto (for example) will make the transport issue any better for all the other areas? We only got the Gautrain in 2010, for the biggest part of that Pride’s existence, people (whites too yes!) had to find their own alternative transports. (The Gautrain still does not cover the areas of the vast majorities of people of all races by the way.) I had numerous friends (including whites), who on many occasions could not attend Pride because of the distance, expense, transport issues and other related matters, and you believe you have the right to insult an entire race group because you are struggling with some inner issues you now wish to polarize into the gay community as well? It is hard enough we have to deal with this in Government politics, but that is not enough for you. No no, you need some action in your life.
I recall Mr Khan, how everyone had an issue with the “pink money” idea at the Old Joburg Pride, that includes the whites. I recall how most of my white friends complained about the expensiveness of the drinks, after you had to stand in those excruciating queues, and after you had to collect your pink money in another que. What are you trying to get at?
I know how most white gay boys I know, struggle to find proper jobs, some no job at all, based on their race, for one, and more so, the fact that they are not as butch and manly as their straight counter parts. You live in an illusion if you think all white gay boys are having lavish lifestyles in Sandton. You have no idea of the layout of a culture, and yet you give yourself the right (which you are NOT entitled to) to insult that culture. I could have driven much respect for your article on many of the other points, but that one little insult threw the cattle cart into carnage. Mr Khan, you have no interest in uniting the gay community. We don’t need you to be part of it either, if this is how you are prepared to bring your message across. Make a factual point where you insult the right people, but stop insulting an entire race group or culture, for fuck knows Elizabeth whatever reasons you have.
I can also honestly say the gay people in general are much more liberal than the Apartheid citizens, boere and Afrikaners (OF THAT TIME). Most white gay boys are much more interested in a free open Liberal South Africa, many of the English speaking white boys also hate sometimes being marginalized as “boere” and “white Afrikaners” even though a lot of the them can’t even speak Afrikaans properly. And those of us who are Afrikaans, and LGBTI, accept our language and background as given, but wish to be liberal, outspoken, and like many of our international counterparts. Regardless Mr Khan (and well your van Vuuren crime partner too, forget to mention him) do any of you have the right anyways to insult an entire culture, regardless of its background. Most of us want to move forward, couldn’t give a Jack Shit (do you know him?) about the ‘ways of the old government’ and just plainly as said – wants to move forward. Now drawing comparisons with Apartheid in that does not help at all. I start to question if you actually realise how bad Apartheid was compared to what LGBTI people get to have today…
I don’t remember arriving at any of the Pride events thinking “racial thoughts”. I went there with my Pride thoughts. And had a good time! I MADE MY OWN GOOD TIME! I don’t expect another to do it on my behalf! To be on a Pride committee, you need to CONTRIBUTE too it too. So why didn’t you join the Joburg Pride committee and contributed?
Circumstances were also different in 1990, and you cannot keep going back to the past, trying to have things be like the “old days”. 1990 is also not one of the most exemplary times of our country’s history to say the least… It is a year that had its own set of the good and bad.
Mr Khan and van Vuuren, I only attended my first Pride in 2009, so I know very little of the past Prides, and the history I read up on, we are the currently the young generation who have to witness this political turmoil. You’re not giving much good education to this generation if you prefer to spread false facts. At least write something bringing your point across, but more reputable then this.
The Old Joburg Pride tried to bring the factions together, by also inviting black artists to perform, playing music that is suited for the township cultures. One Pride event (I’m not going to say which on) had to end on a budget of R160 000 and made a massive loss at the end of the day. You think setting that huge stage, arranging that parade, all that electricity, getting all that merchandise in there, security fees, the rent, all of that is cheap? You arrange a Pride event and let me know if you can provide it to people with free drinks… Where do you think that R160 000 comes from? Do you know how to obtain the rights for such an event? Do you know the license process and rules to be followed for the drinking and alcohol at such an event? Have you ever arranged an event? LOL. It is mainly a few millionaires within our community who had to sponsor the expenses out of their own pockets (they don’t have to, they do so at their own free will). Most of our pride events in Gauteng are not even managed under a non-profit organizations (they should be). Be part of the arrangements of such a huge event, and you let me know where you think the rights and money had to come from… And where the money have to go to after that…
I read from the article’s commentaries already one poor foreign soul, you got the wrong impression (and education) from your partial un-factual article. At least it is just your opinion.
Hope you had your thrill for the day by all the hatred incited “action” you got from your post.
Dear Frans-Petrus,
Thank you for you substantive feedback. I will ignore the ad hominem arguments.
The point of this article was to highlight the way race, class and the terrible heritage of apartheid influences the way queer spaces (like Pride) are constructed. The effect of race and class is apparent in the social and geographic makeup of the variety of Pride marches. The social and economic effect of apartheid is exceedingly well documented. If you would like me to share some sources – I could email you these documents with pleasure.
Also please do share examples of what you believe to be untrue. This article is based on documents in the GALA archive and the multiple conversations I have had with queer/trans activist in Johannesburg.
Revolutionary love,
Gabriel
Rre Frans-Petrus Zeelie
I am not very well read or spoken, but I find your response is quite interesting in its academic & conscious nature. Just a few questions:
1. For someone like me (and a lot of South african queers, young, unexposed and “immobile”), what would be the easiest way to access a pride in Zoolake in your full queer attire without the privilege of that google maps thingy and a car?
2. If the pride is expensive for everyone “equally”(as your response seems to suggest), why should we accept it?
3. If you find that both black and non-black queer South Africans experience financial difficulty and unemployment, would it be wrong to address this at the biggest platform for queers in Gauteng? Or would you prefer to allow queers to be exploited by a commercialised movement that’s after pink money?
4. I would like to know who was insulted and in what way
5. Can you honestly say that the following combination of words are not racially heated “by also inviting black artists to perform”?
6. If you haven’t been exposed to alternative Prides and factual Pride history, can you honestly assume that the statement in this article are untrue?
Those are only a few easy questions for clarity nje. Oh, you do know that organising a political and conscious Pride event that addresses issues and gives access to a diverse queer population is not so far fetched for people like Mr Khan, right?
One of the best archives you can consult for queer African activity can be found at the Gay and Lesbian Memory in Action (GALA). Then you might not feel as attacked and may see things differently.
Tshego (and Mr Khan),
Answers:
1.) A valid question indeed, and many have to struggle with transport issues, it is not just a white thing ok? You seem to just assume because someone has a white skin that they now have limousines; private jets; Ferrari’s; and posh yachts to come gliding glamorously into Pride (most don’t!). When the whole e-toll mess started, it was apparent to me how all factions of our diverse society complained unanimously about the same issue: THERE ARE NO PROPER PUBLIC TRANSPORT ALTERNATIVES FOR ANYONE. Many people, including white youths and others do not have cars, or can afford the distances. So the answer to this question is to do what well, most of us do: car pool. Piggy back a ride with someone, create a group point for a pickup by a hired minibus or use the Gautrain (only recently available). Here is the option many use when they can’t go to Pride (including whites, Mr Khan are you listening?): Stay at home… No single location in Gauteng is going to be centralised enough for the entire province. It is a province, with 10 municipalities and 5 major city centres… What do you expect?
2.) Not sure I’m getting your point? Your expense for Pride is: (1) Transport. (2) Drinks. (3) Attire. Transport costs are each his own. Drinks cost the same as any other place in the cities, bars, restaurants and supermarkets, everywhere. You won’t even get drinks cheap at wholesale prices. Those costs are controlled by the circumstances of the economy. Not Pride. Not by whites. You need to understand the dynamics of the economy to understand the costs for things… Everyone in South Africa agrees, inflation is way above income increases per year. Nobody is immune to that. The fees charged at the stalls is well: The stall owner’s fee, not Pride’s. Attire – well, that depends on oneself. Most of the time I go with a t-shirt and shorts. Most people I know cannot afford all those extravagant outfits. Unless this is your impression that you can only go to Pride if you are dressed in multi rainbow colour feathers? Yes it is cool, but most of us don’t want to or can afford it…
3.) Uhm, I don’t get your question? The pink money thing was what I used as an example that was a frustration for everyone. No other Pride event currently in circuit are using pink money, as far as I know… What are you getting at? See no 1 and 2 above, you might find an answer to the ‘commercialised’ part, and go and read Kaya’s response to Gabriel’s article, which will also include more insight. If you know the expenses of a Pride event which only the organisers usually carry out of their own pockets, everything else you get – you already get for free.
4.) Did you read the article? “We cannot support an event which created a fenced boundary for rich, mostly white people to celebrate Pride”. There I quoted one thing Gabriel said. And another: “ This was reflected by the fact that the board of Johannesburg Pride and its audience was largely white and middle-class.” Sounds very clear as if Mr Khan believe the whole issue in Pride is white peoples fault…
5.) I mentioned that black artists are invited because seems that you and Mr Khan don’t wish to understand that South Africa is diverse with various cultures. Each culture has their own taste and liking. Even in music. The old Joburg Pride event organisers invited people from the African culture (better wording to use?) in later years to assist in attracting people from the other cultures as well. I don’t know how to put it to you? I just wanted to be direct and clear. That does not create racial heat because it was not aimed at insult or as Mr Khan did – BLAME. It was directed at pointing out a certain culture’s taste in music was also invited to the event… (suppose to be a good thing… wtf!) Surely you can extinguish between the two?
6.) Appart from 24 years since the first Pride, and 24 years of change from conservative SA to modern SA, what is it that you expect at a 2014 Pride event? Tradition? Old-schoolnism? Apartheid activism? Shouldn’t it be focusing on today’s modern issue among LGBTI’s? You already mentioned one: Many of the different races in the LGBTI community struggle to find jobs, due to homophobes and hate against gays… And that is why we still have Pride events, to create awareness to the public and the help the public realise we are here, big and in full existence. Pride is not going to change homophobia, the education to people are going to do that, and that is why a Pride event should host a non-profit organization to collect money to be used in noble LGBTI activities, including that of educating the public – something which is more the Government’s job, partially due to influence factors.
If Mr Khan didn’t have a history of racial hatred towards whites, I may have wanted to entertain your last sentences there, but I’m not going to. Why else would he want to marginalised and entire race group (especially the white youth of today) if it weren’t meant to be hatred towards whites?
We struggle with enough LGBTI issues in SA, Mr Khan dividing the race groups, is not assisting with that problem. I was brought up in a house where my mother taught me to respect everyone. She taught me from childhood that you never look down on anyone no matter of their race or gender. In my growing up years, I discovered many other whites who had similar teachings… It is but a small group of whites that get brought up to look down on other races, as very much the same you get in the other ethnic groups as well. That is no new news. Mr Khan don’t seem to think that.
I read the comments from some of the other readers, and how I realised that Mr Khan is clearly focusing racial hatred, was what they derived and understood from the article. It isn’t rocket science to come to terms as to what Mr Khan was trying to say.
Dear Frans-Petrus,
I believe that you are mistaking are approach to systemic injustice to hatred for a race. I don’t hold any adverse feelings to any particular group. That being said, when talking about systemic injustice – I believe it is important to talk about (and to groups in positions of privilege). I do that in my work with queer/trans communities – by engaging heterosexual people and heteronormative practices. I know feminist activist do this through critiques of men, and anti-racist activist through critiques of the way systemic racism manifest. Engaging systemic racism would mean having tough conversations about whiteness and blackness (and other races) and social/economic/cultural concepts. When I engage whiteness, it is on this level.
I base my opinion on ideas explored in the followings texts (these are basic reads, and I could share more critical texts if you so wish).
On defining white privilege: http://amptoons.com/blog/files/mcintosh.html
On things to reflect on before trying to speak about race: http://www.thefrisky.com/2014-06-12/18-things-white-people-should-knowdo-before-discussing-racism/
On the current politics of white privilege in South Africa:
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/oct/21/south-africa-white-privilege-afrikaner
On who owns what and race in South Africa:
http://mg.co.za/article/2011-12-09-who-owns-what-by-race/
On income and race in South Africa:
http://mg.co.za/article/2012-10-30-census-2011-50-years-for-blacks-to-catch-up
On who own most of SA:
http://businesstech.co.za/news/general/53871/south-africas-richest-people-in-2014/
More on the SA white privilege debate:
http://mg.co.za/article/2011-09-12-inherited-or-earned-advantage
I also wrote an article a while ago about how this goes down in the ‘gay’ community:https://www.mambaonline.com/2014/02/11/dear-white-gay-boys/ Let mw know what you think
I don’t expect conversations about the complex ways race, class, gender and sexuality converge to be easy. It is ok to feel challenged by these ideas. I urge you to engage these texts, to reflect on the way inequality currently manifests in South Africa and to get back to me. I am always open to open and frank conversations about systemic injustice. This is how I show love, through challenging injustice.
Revolutionary love and hugs,
Gabriel
Typical Marxist Postmodernist approach. Why build anything new when you can just tear down the existing social structures and leave society a blasted wasteland? Look how well that’s worked in the rest of Africa.
Hi Mr Zeelie Amen , what you saying it’s true blaming n pointing finger wont change the matter at hand (uniting LGBTI community)…people must learn to deal with their issues and stop planting their dirty minds in other…am a Pretorian my self from township called Soshanguve and am telling you the first time i attended Pride in Zoo lake 2012 i had so much fun , the was no racial , culture issues cause we partied with people of all race , had my own food drinks , food and all no fence has stopped me from having fun….
Thank you for your feedback. I would suggest popping by GALA (www.gala.co.za) to learn more about the various Prides and other inclusive queer/trans activities in the city.
There’s actually 6 including the one in Vaal
I have pride fatigue…. I just don’t see the point anymore! The activists have their pride in town , african peeps have theirs in soweto etc and the boere have theirs in PTA (yea i know their is cross over but its limited). I miss the days where we all came together, one unit, one voice and yes one party! I have great memories of connecting with my brothers and sisters from all communities and walks of life on the lawns of zoo lake, celebrating our victories and uniting as ONE, strengthening our voice and message.
Now that Pride has shattered it has just lost its voice, its power and of course its true meaning (which has been well debated)
The Pride at zoo lake definitely was the best Pride that Africa has ever seen. It would of been perfect with a bit of fine tuning and if communities came together and did not just criticise the organisers . In general, as per other prides around SA and the globe its a small group of volunteers who pull it off to the best of their abilities, usually at the last minute. Often with limited funding and much resistance. And of course with no or little thanks at the end.
I would love to see the communities properly join forces to create an authentic pride. A mixture of Activists (gender, hiv, queer political etc) , event planners (experise) and of course the public from across the sectors to team up their strengths and create the platform for issues as well as the the gathering/party/parade we so desperately need. Sadly at the moment, in some of the pride events its is being run by ego and greed
And dear activists, lets face it, your’e not going to gather 20 000 people for a queer activist type protest, this is why an Authentic Pride is the perfect platform to bring your message to the masses and the public, never forget your responsibilities to your community.
In the words of Sharon from OIA: If we are not visible, we do NOT exist…
P.S: What will it take for us to stand together again? Something more drastic than another one of our sisters getting murdered in the townships? Government changing the constitution? I shudder to think….
Gunther:
“I would love to see the communities properly join forces to create an authentic pride.” And giving an utter bullshit unfactual detailed lie like “and the boere have theirs in PTA” .
The Pretoria Pride is a OPEN FOR ANYONE to attend. There is no rule, regulation, attempt, planning, decree issued of any nature that prevents any race, group person of any kind from attending the Pretoria Pride (you probably don’t even know what a boer is). By insulting the Pretoria Pride racially in the one sentence and then “hoping for unity” in another is not going to bring any from unity. It just marginalize and stereotype groups on false truths, and in return makes people angry, and less likely to stand together (the same goes for Gabriel Hoosain Khan, who is famous for his constant attempt to marginalize minor racial groups and insults an entire culture for his own personal pleasures). You have no interest in bringing together the different groups in the gay community, you just wish to incite hatred among race groups. Trust me, if I insult you on false facts, are you suddenly going to come running to my arms in tears and say “ooh Fransie you are so right, I love you!” NO.
The Pretoria Pride was created because of the politics in the old Joburg Pride and because the EXPENSIVENESS of the old Pride (showing that there are many whites out there who also have an issue with the expensiveness of these events). Trust me Gunther (and Gabriel Hoosain Khan), you are having illusions. And don’t get up in arms because you are being insulted, you did exactly the same, on false facts. This is not constructive at all. I don’t think anyone reading this article are now going to feel more compelled to be ‘united’.
Gone are the days of apartheid. Why is it that we have to have more than 1 pride? Where is the unity amongst us? Why must we meet at different locations? How will we meet other people by pride hopping? Why cant we have it at 1 venue where we take to the streets and unite proudly? We end up spending much more by pride hopping than having 1 united pride. Has this to become a money making scheme or what? The LGBTi Westrand group boycotts all pride venues till we can reunite as 1 again!
I’m 100% behind Khan and Van Vuuren, keep being vocal about these things until the message gets across! The reality of race, class and even gender must be taken into consideration and cannot be ignored. Zeelie and others who speak from their white privilege need to wake up from whatever lala land they’re dreaming in. I’m not trying to be offensive or hate on anyone but I think it’s time you realise it’s not all about you and your white liberal tendencies. To think that apartheid is dead and gone is preposterous, I’m a born free and I can clearly see it’s legacy is alive and kicking, and you can see this whole issue has it’s roots in the mentality that apartheid gave those who benefited from it. That pride can be boycotted by people of colour.
Sanam,
What is that you suggest the gay Prides do to make it less racially divided? Because you seem that the general function of Pride is only in favor of whites. So place your clearly thought through suggestions here and I’m sure somewhere a Pride event will gladly try to implement it. We are listening.
Pride was never perfect, and it is always necessary to reflect on one’s practices and consider how they might, even inadvertently, exclude others. But from 1995 till 2012 I attended every Johannesburg Pride, and despite the flaws it was an important occasion to stand together. The political disruption of that Pride succeeded in dividing an already fragile and flawed unity, and the GLBTI Community has been weakened by that. It certainly is true that many whites, and also many gay whites take privilege for granted, to the extent that they are unaware (and angered) by the very notion, but the divided Prides, and acrimonious debates will not effectively address any of the problems, and the political unity weakened when it is very important to consolidate and defend the gains made, and shape a gay community that can address issues of race and class, with debate but without rancorous and destructive grand standing. Sadly, that is very unlikely to happen, and the voice of the GBLTI community has been damaged by ourselves. We should not take our legal freedoms for granted, and act in a united political front to extend the theoretical Constitutional framework into a lived reality for gays and lesbians, bisexuals and transgendered across the very real divides of race and money.
Myself and a few friends have attended numerous yrs of Pride events. I agree with some of te arguments. We also battle to get to the event but we car pool and make a plan, yes I think that one should be allowed your own food and drink. we also attended Pta and Soweto pride this year. I was highly discussed with Soweto Pride as to when it was time for announcements one of the organiser got on stage and arrogantly expressed that Soweto Pride is a black man’s Pride that “us” Whites don’t belong there. They tried to encourage the fellow goers to boycott Jhb Pride and informed them of the date, which was also incorrect, slandering the other prides with every sentence.. Now I ask you who’s the racist, why should we then bother with Soweto if they are only going to continue braking us down. I am 30 yrs of age and by the time I was old enough to make decision about any racist aspects, they were already my friends. So why punish me for something my grandparents did? I had nothing to do with that regime and do not want to. I believe in judging NO ONE accept EVERYONE… I will never again attend a Soweto Pride…
Khan and Van Vuuren, you speak of unity and impulsivity and all things beautiful, yet, I felt unbelievably excluded while reading this. So,
Quick questions:
1: If we are aiming for inclusivity, why do you so often use the term GAY as an umbrella term for all of us? It alienates and aggravates me.
2: What about other forms of oppression which you are consciously ignoring? You only speak of race and class in the very same article that you casually mention the feminist collective?
I’m just a little confused about the fact that your article speaks to unity yet you made me feel like I do not belong to any of these prides as I do not identify as “gay” and due to the fact that you didn’t really care much for other parts of this discussion such as gender
Inclusivity, not impulsivity(obviously)
This is incredibly painful to see our victories so undermined. I don’t believe that most of the organisers of this plethora of Prides have any political and historical understanding of the significance of Pride. What a great disappointment this trading of insults and undermining of our unity must be to our trailblazing heroes like Bev Ditsie, Simon Nkoli, Adv Cameron (now Judge Cameron) who waged brave struggles and actively worked the polical scene so that the Codesa negotiators could include gay rights in the Constitution. We need a strong gay movement or organisation in this country to continuously protect our rights. Otherwise, one day we shall wake up only to find that we have a Uganda, Zimbabwe and any other homophobic country on this continent, right here in our country!!! Moffies, wake up and be vigilant.
PS: My excuse to those who are offended to be called gay. To me this is an all encompassing term for the LGBTI community. Keep the eyes on the ball please, not some insignificant semantics.
Mr Khan is at it again. By “at it,” I mean stirring controversy. Controversy, if based on accurate facts, and constructive criticism, might be helpful. However, Mr Khan lacks, often, both of these requirements.
The first Pride Parade was not solely initiated by Simon Nkoli. Mr Khan could find this out were he to do a little basic research from works that are easily available. furthermore, that event which, because of his age, I suspect mr Khan didn’t attend, could ahrdly be described as the happy gathering of the like-minded and ideologically unified, that Mr Khan depicts in his soemwhat inaccurate “utopian” representation./The authors’ claim that the “only way forward” is for “gay people” to be informed, is a little naive, something that becomes ever more apparent in their statment that through information we would avoid “repeating history.” What these authors advocate is itself a repetition of history. Many of us have not advocated information, but supplied it over more years than we care to remember. A crucial feature, largely ignored by the authors, is that from its inception through until the passage of the Civil Union Act, “gay people” had a unifying AIM. this was already crumbling around 1998/9 when the Coalition for Gay and Lesbian Equality, a paper tiger that had punched way above its weight, started falling apart. Without the driving force of this organization, and without the goal of the removal of discriminatory legislation, there was indeed very little to unite LGBTI people. //It is ahrd, if not impossible, to envisage a “united front” amongst LGBTI citizens after the early 2000s. IS this a bad thing? Not necessarily. The fracas in Jan smuts avenue which the authors allude to, made this disunity very graphically and very disruptively. To posit a Pride Parade on the basis of alleged shared interests between LGBTI people is completely misguided, in that it fails to understand the current realities of what was always ONLY an “imagined community.” This logical flaw is at the ehart of the authors’ analysis and inflicts cardiac arrest on their major claim.// I am not sure if the authros HAVE much exposure to younger LGBTI people? They, like the majority of their elders, display a (shocking) lack of political interest. “Information” is unlikely to spur these people into anything one could accurately call political engagement. Nor is it likely that they would be roused by a specifically LGBTI-focused political interest.// The proliferation of “Prides” in Gauteng is not necessarily a sign of divisiveness in itself. it is “good” that local communities see and hear of the presence of LGBTI citizens in their midst. Far better than simply seeing the standard picture of a man in drag pictured at Zoo Lake, and tucked into some section of the Sunday Times./ If only the authors themselves were a little better informed, a little more astutely critical.
well we still have a lot to work on as feminist and activists Khan i know and feel where you come from ,i was part of the direct action of 1in9 campaign in 2012 and being kicked and told to go back to my location really stayed with me till today i still find Johannesburg peoples pride a home for everyone and a memory to Simon
I will like 2 c more
Now that we’re (hopefully) done with the criticism, how about commenting with suggestions on how you personally would like to see these events moving forward in a positive way. Let’s focus on solutions rather than finding problems.